Gonzaga Prediction AND Game Thread

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Re: Gonzaga Prediction AND Game Thread

Postby drbluejay » Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:30 pm

The lost to Gonzaga is the first time after looking at the last 60 losses by Creighton that they got outscored by more than 20 points in the 2nd half. My guess is it is the first time in the last 25 years that it happened.
Before losing to Gonzaga, the previous outscored I found was 16 and there were only 12 times in those 60 games that CU was outscored by double figures. Of those 60 losses, CU outscored them 19 times in the 2nd half and tied them 3 times + another tied 2nd half going into overtime. Perception can be very wrong by us all.
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Re: Gonzaga Prediction AND Game Thread

Postby Trifecta » Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:40 pm

LOL @ the "you aren't a real fan if you make criticisms of the coaches/staff/program" sentiment a few pages back. Talking about our basketball program feels like discussing politics. You have so many people on two extreme ends of the spectrum : the sunshine pumpers that attack any criticism or observations of weakness in the team, and doom & gloomers that think every loss means our program is terrible and the coaches should all be run out of town. Nobody can agree that there is a little bit of merit in the arugment of both sides. I hate our message board sometimes...any dissenting views are met with pitchforks and torches. Yes Gonzaga is better than us, but is suggesting that Mac got out-coached in the 2nd half that outlandish? You know who gets out-coached by Few? Almost everyone in the country does.

I'll say up front I fully expected us to lose on the road by 10 + to the Zags. There is no shame in losing to an elite program in an extremely hostile enviroment. But I think it's the way we lost that is causing a lot of hand-wringing. The is a great, but not elite, Zags team. I stand by my belief we had the best 2 players on the court. And we had controlled almost the entire first half. But to get completely blown out, look non-competitive, and piss that 2nd half down our legs is troubling. That's on both Mac AND team. Mac can't do everything on the court, but I would've liked him to stop the bleeding.

And I didn't expect the team to be this far along this early. But just because the team is probably exceeding the expectations of the fanbase doesn't mean they don't have warts. The early season success may be a bit of fool's gold (the NU win isn't looking so hot, and the freshman have come back down to earth a little bit). But we have a solid team that is more than capable of winning 20+ games IMO. Tyshon and Mitch are going to be solid by the end of the year. Martin is blowing me away with what he's done. Getting Toby back is going to make us more consistent. And this early season schedule is only going to prepare for conference play.
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Re: Gonzaga Prediction AND Game Thread

Postby cujaysfan » Sun Dec 03, 2017 2:03 pm

Trifecta wrote:LOL @ the "you aren't a real fan if you make criticisms of the coaches/staff/program" sentiment a few pages back. Talking about our basketball program feels like discussing politics. You have so many people on two extreme ends of the spectrum : the sunshine pumpers that attack any criticism or observations of weakness in the team, and doom & gloomers that think every loss means our program is terrible and the coaches should all be run out of town. Nobody can agree that there is a little bit of merit in the arugment of both sides. I hate our message board sometimes...any dissenting views are met with pitchforks and torches. Yes Gonzaga is better than us, but is suggesting that Mac got out-coached in the 2nd half that outlandish? You know who gets out-coached by Few? Almost everyone in the country does.

I'll say up front I fully expected us to lose on the road by 10 + to the Zags. There is no shame in losing to an elite program in an extremely hostile enviroment. But I think it's the way we lost that is causing a lot of hand-wringing. The is a great, but not elite, Zags team. I stand by my belief we had the best 2 players on the court. And we had controlled almost the entire first half. But to get completely blown out, look non-competitive, and piss that 2nd half down our legs is troubling. That's on both Mac AND team. Mac can't do everything on the court, but I would've liked him to stop the bleeding.

And I didn't expect the team to be this far along this early. But just because the team is probably exceeding the expectations of the fanbase doesn't mean they don't have warts. The early season success may be a bit of fool's gold (the NU win isn't looking so hot, and the freshman have come back down to earth a little bit). But we have a solid team that is more than capable of winning 20+ games IMO. Tyshon and Mitch are going to be solid by the end of the year. Martin is blowing me away with what he's done. Getting Toby back is going to make us more consistent. And this early season schedule is only going to prepare for conference play.


that pretty much sums it up perfectly for me - nice job
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Re: Gonzaga Prediction AND Game Thread

Postby drbluejay » Sun Dec 03, 2017 2:08 pm

cujaysfan wrote:
Trifecta wrote:LOL @ the "you aren't a real fan if you make criticisms of the coaches/staff/program" sentiment a few pages back. Talking about our basketball program feels like discussing politics. You have so many people on two extreme ends of the spectrum : the sunshine pumpers that attack any criticism or observations of weakness in the team, and doom & gloomers that think every loss means our program is terrible and the coaches should all be run out of town. Nobody can agree that there is a little bit of merit in the arugment of both sides. I hate our message board sometimes...any dissenting views are met with pitchforks and torches. Yes Gonzaga is better than us, but is suggesting that Mac got out-coached in the 2nd half that outlandish? You know who gets out-coached by Few? Almost everyone in the country does.

I'll say up front I fully expected us to lose on the road by 10 + to the Zags. There is no shame in losing to an elite program in an extremely hostile enviroment. But I think it's the way we lost that is causing a lot of hand-wringing. The is a great, but not elite, Zags team. I stand by my belief we had the best 2 players on the court. And we had controlled almost the entire first half. But to get completely blown out, look non-competitive, and piss that 2nd half down our legs is troubling. That's on both Mac AND team. Mac can't do everything on the court, but I would've liked him to stop the bleeding.

And I didn't expect the team to be this far along this early. But just because the team is probably exceeding the expectations of the fanbase doesn't mean they don't have warts. The early season success may be a bit of fool's gold (the NU win isn't looking so hot, and the freshman have come back down to earth a little bit). But we have a solid team that is more than capable of winning 20+ games IMO. Tyshon and Mitch are going to be solid by the end of the year. Martin is blowing me away with what he's done. Getting Toby back is going to make us more consistent. And this early season schedule is only going to prepare for conference play.


that pretty much sums it up perfectly for me - nice job

I'm still trying to find where it was said, you aren't a true fan if you make criticisms etc.? but I like your post.
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Re: Gonzaga Prediction AND Game Thread

Postby mredle » Sun Dec 03, 2017 6:26 pm

Trifecta wrote:LOL @ the "you aren't a real fan if you make criticisms of the coaches/staff/program" sentiment a few pages back. Talking about our basketball program feels like discussing politics. You have so many people on two extreme ends of the spectrum : the sunshine pumpers that attack any criticism or observations of weakness in the team, and doom & gloomers that think every loss means our program is terrible and the coaches should all be run out of town. Nobody can agree that there is a little bit of merit in the arugment of both sides. I hate our message board sometimes...any dissenting views are met with pitchforks and torches. Yes Gonzaga is better than us, but is suggesting that Mac got out-coached in the 2nd half that outlandish? You know who gets out-coached by Few? Almost everyone in the country does.

I'll say up front I fully expected us to lose on the road by 10 + to the Zags. There is no shame in losing to an elite program in an extremely hostile enviroment. But I think it's the way we lost that is causing a lot of hand-wringing. The is a great, but not elite, Zags team. I stand by my belief we had the best 2 players on the court. And we had controlled almost the entire first half. But to get completely blown out, look non-competitive, and piss that 2nd half down our legs is troubling. That's on both Mac AND team. Mac can't do everything on the court, but I would've liked him to stop the bleeding.

And I didn't expect the team to be this far along this early. But just because the team is probably exceeding the expectations of the fanbase doesn't mean they don't have warts. The early season success may be a bit of fool's gold (the NU win isn't looking so hot, and the freshman have come back down to earth a little bit). But we have a solid team that is more than capable of winning 20+ games IMO. Tyshon and Mitch are going to be solid by the end of the year. Martin is blowing me away with what he's done. Getting Toby back is going to make us more consistent. And this early season schedule is only going to prepare for conference play.


Trifecta: I don't know that most of the people contesting the "Mac is terrible at making adjustments after half time" are arguing "you aren't a fan if...." I think many people are contesting the former premise in the absence of any relevant empirical support for that proposition. I'm not accusing you in making that statement because I haven't gone back and looked for any evidence to support that view. In fact, my subjective judgment is that you are correct when you say Foster and Thomas were the 2 best players on the court, certainly better than GU's 2 stars going into the game. However, in my view, we lost the game because the Zags supporting cast substantially outplayed our supporting cast in this game and that was the difference in the outcome.
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Re: Gonzaga Prediction AND Game Thread

Postby Venturajay » Sun Dec 03, 2017 10:52 pm

I like this team and Coach Mac. However, I don't know if he is capable of taking us to the next level. His team's continually collapse in the second half this was even true during the 2014-2015 season when they placed last or next to last but lost numerous games in the last 2 minutes. Any who, I hope that I am wrong.
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Re: Gonzaga Prediction AND Game Thread

Postby Waylon Van Smack » Mon Dec 04, 2017 7:13 am

Venturajay wrote:I like this team and Coach Mac. However, I don't know if he is capable of taking us to the next level. His team's continually collapse in the second half this was even true during the 2014-2015 season when they placed last or next to last but lost numerous games in the last 2 minutes. Any who, I hope that I am wrong.

You mean the NEXT, next level right? Mac started here and CU was in the MVC playing one conference opponent that usually had national implications. In total fairness, this program is almost unrecognizable from that era. Multiple national rankings, hosting the seating national champion, btw, a champion that came from its current conference, playing nationally televised games on one of the biggest networks, a network that broadcasts Superbowls. I still pinch myself to see the names of schools CU gets to play on a regular basis knowing it never would have happened where they were..... and the talent that has come into or is potentially coming into this program, frankly, it's downright amazing. I'm also amazed how portions of a fanbase sweep past things like beating 2 top 25 opponents in a row but complain about the other top25 losses, surely those are they JaySker portions of a delusional fanbase? Sure, the second half performances are concerning, free throw percentages are concerning, rebounding etc..... All in an immediate perspective, but to say Mac isn't the guy to get "us to the next level" is simply false. CU is already at the next level and a large reason for it is Mac and Ras. If Mac were to have taken that other offer last spring his legacy would have been huge. I am enjoying every step forward.
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Re: Gonzaga Prediction AND Game Thread

Postby ZMagic30 » Mon Dec 04, 2017 8:19 am

“If you criticize this team, you’re a Jaysker”

Logic checks out
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